How do I recognize a durable engine?

Talk about anything scooters.
Post Reply
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

When shopping for a new scooter, or a new motor for an old one, how can I recognize a good motor? Are there certain alloys for blocks that are better? certain designs? brands? Any other insight about motors, carbs, distrib. etc will be welcome.

How many hours does it take to custom assemble an engine? is it difficult for a person with no experience with scooter engines but who is mechanically inclined?
User avatar
crashoverride
Throttle Master
Throttle Master
Posts: 325
Joined: Sun May 17, 2009 5:27 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: St. Catharines Ontario
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by crashoverride »

You could start with a compression test.

Crash
1985 Honda CH250 Elite, HJC CL-33
1984 Honda VT500C Shadow
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

Thanks! But I am thinking more about recognizing a good design of a new engine as opposed to checking out a second hand one.
User avatar
donny
Scooter Legend
Scooter Legend
Posts: 2535
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: hamilton, ont can.
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by donny »

how many kilometers do you think you will travel over whole trip? you could buy a good 2 stroke 49cc scooter new from china and do whole trip and sell it when done? b4 motor requires rebuild?
presently enjoy riding a Ruckus and a Super 9. Tinkering with a Riva 180 and a couple of old Puch SV's. In the off season I enjoy a 1999 Polaris Indy 600 XLT Touring and a 2014 Artic Cat Prowler side by side
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

That is a good thought. I will probably put 300 miles a week on it doing my daily driving. One weekend a month I am going to cut loose (I have 3 day weekends every week) and probably put on more than 600 miles. I love driving/riding on long, open roads - I find it very therepeutic! If the bike (and I) prove to be road worthy, the big trip is going to be 2,500 miles. That translates into more than 20K per year. My guess - based on the e-scooter I bought here a couple of years ago - that at about 5K, things are going to start needing attention, and at 10K a 2 stroke may need a rebuild?

The extra power from a 2 stroke engine might be useful. I have seen a number of water-cooled 2 stroke engines for sale in China. The extra strength and cooling from the water jacket might make the 2 stroke last a year.
User avatar
donny
Scooter Legend
Scooter Legend
Posts: 2535
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: hamilton, ont can.
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by donny »

i went back to a old thread on Chinese scooters and a member from Texas i think stated that Znen company is making a better quality engines, they make that TNG scooter that dan showed you and a few other makes, maybe you should look into them?
presently enjoy riding a Ruckus and a Super 9. Tinkering with a Riva 180 and a couple of old Puch SV's. In the off season I enjoy a 1999 Polaris Indy 600 XLT Touring and a 2014 Artic Cat Prowler side by side
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

Thanks! I will look into it.
User avatar
Dan Durston
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 2719
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 2:07 am
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Location: Victoria, BC
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by Dan Durston »

Recognizing a good engine is hard to do. There are a lot of good designs out there, but most of them have also been copied and the copies are poorly put together so they may be a good design but still going to fail because they are sloppily assembled. Watercooling is a good thing, but a lot of cheap chinese companies try to impress you with specifications so they do fancy stuff like watercooling but by trying to do everything, they end up sucking at everything because they don't really know what they are doing. I would rather have a simply motor from Honda that a fancy water cooled fuel injected chinese motor which is certainly going to run into troubles in no time because of all that complex parts that were hastily put together with very little testing.

The best indicator of engine quality is likely the reputation of the manufacturer.
Scooters Owned: 2003 Ruckus, 2006 Ruckus, 1983 Yamaha Beluga 80, 2007 Vespa LX 150, 2009 Yamaha BWS 125, 2008 Ruckus
User avatar
donny
Scooter Legend
Scooter Legend
Posts: 2535
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: hamilton, ont can.
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by donny »

hmmm.... this is interesting, since some good scooters have come over here and cost anywhere from 1500-2000$. And you are there so i wonder if you would pay more than a 1000$ for the same scooter in China? or less!

things too look for in quality in manufacturing would be, engine, is the cylinder sleeved? the cheap one's do not sleeve cylinders or maybe a light chrome at best(no life span) the charging system, quality of wire used? and the stator system for charging should have at least6-8 pick ups too properly charge the system (the cheap ones only have 2-3 pick ups in stator) will work for a while but will get weak and die,not good at nite. i think water cooled is the way to go but again the quality of manufacturing must be evaluated. hey what about a warranty if you bought a Chinese scooter new? they seem to live up to their warranty here in most cases from members in Texas that ride them

now i think you must watch out for the pure ripoff clones of the Japanese and others, something about patent laws internationally are or have been ignored and some manufactures in China have copied them right down to color and logo, pure copies with no quality. and then models with close names as the big 3 like YAMMAHO etc..

over all i think you should be able to buy a Chinese scooter and and have a great adventure with out spending too much, home work!

oh i see on the news you got snow like us :lol:
presently enjoy riding a Ruckus and a Super 9. Tinkering with a Riva 180 and a couple of old Puch SV's. In the off season I enjoy a 1999 Polaris Indy 600 XLT Touring and a 2014 Artic Cat Prowler side by side
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

Thanks! I can buy a local scooter for about US$ 400 but people have advised me not to ride it any distance at one time, probably not more than 40-50 km at a time. I have seen some suzuki's (genuine) for about US $1,100 that people say are durable enough to tour with. Problem is...they are hot items to steal.
User avatar
donny
Scooter Legend
Scooter Legend
Posts: 2535
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: hamilton, ont can.
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by donny »

pengyou wrote:Thanks! I can buy a local scooter for about US$ 400 but people have advised me not to ride it any distance at one time, probably not more than 40-50 km at a time. I have seen some suzuki's (genuine) for about US $1,100 that people say are durable enough to tour with. Problem is...they are hot items to steal.
interesting? the only suziki scooters sold in Canada are Bergman's, they are loaded 400-600cc scooters. they are beautiful touring scooters, and big$$
been a while since suzuki sold small cc here.
presently enjoy riding a Ruckus and a Super 9. Tinkering with a Riva 180 and a couple of old Puch SV's. In the off season I enjoy a 1999 Polaris Indy 600 XLT Touring and a 2014 Artic Cat Prowler side by side
pengyou
Rim Kicker
Rim Kicker
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 4:31 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by pengyou »

Well, in China I don't think any kind of motorized vehicle with more than 250 cc can be sold, without some special provision$$$$$$$ Most common sizes here are 50, 70 and 100...though the slightly larger sizes are starting to creep up. Most developing nations live by the 50 cc engines.
User avatar
donny
Scooter Legend
Scooter Legend
Posts: 2535
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:08 pm
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1965
Location: hamilton, ont can.
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by donny »

the one thing i remember about the 50cc suzuki when it was sold here that the tires were the smallest i had ever seen on a scooter and thought they could be dangerous on rough road, a fair size pot hole could wipe you out. that was the first thing that attracted me to my Honda ruckus was big tires.
presently enjoy riding a Ruckus and a Super 9. Tinkering with a Riva 180 and a couple of old Puch SV's. In the off season I enjoy a 1999 Polaris Indy 600 XLT Touring and a 2014 Artic Cat Prowler side by side
User avatar
Dan Durston
Site Admin
Site Admin
Posts: 2719
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 2:07 am
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Location: Victoria, BC
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by Dan Durston »

Yeah suzuki only sold one 50cc here ever (the Hyper AE50) and that was only for a few years in the early 90's. Besides that, the smallest scooter they've sold has been the Bergman 400 I believe. You can read more about the Hyper AE50 here:
http://www.motorscooterguide.net/page35 ... age36.html
Scooters Owned: 2003 Ruckus, 2006 Ruckus, 1983 Yamaha Beluga 80, 2007 Vespa LX 150, 2009 Yamaha BWS 125, 2008 Ruckus
kz1000st
Step Thru Star
Step Thru Star
Posts: 189
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:58 am
To prevent spam, enter the year 'modern' scooters were first sold in North America (hint: 1982): 1982
Location: NY, USA
Contact:

Re: How do I recognize a durable engine?

Post by kz1000st »

I don't what names they're sold in-country, but both Znen and Chongqing Astronautical Bashan Motorcycle Company assemble their engines on site and use better quality parts than others. The secret to a Chinese scooter is checking everything when you get it to make sure that all the bolts and nuts are tight and all the electrical connections are secure. If you do this you can ride as far as you like.
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 9 guests